Check Yes or No

But enough about me, what do YOU think of me?

IG: @sarahonpurpose

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SPEAKER_00 0:06

Let me clear my throat. Hi guys. I have a thing I want to talk about that honestly I feel a little shy to discuss. Probably because it just sounds so lame. I want to talk about my big V. And no, that doesn't mean vagina. It means vulnerability, okay? Self-discovery stuff and finding your spark and your voice, those are all things I love talking about. I love learning about that stuff. I love writing about that stuff. And now here I am making a podcast again. And I realize this is all starting to get a little meta, talking about how hard it is to make a podcast on a podcast. But there is a point, I swear. If we're going to talk about why it's been so difficult for me to find my voice, my spark and myself, I've got to tell you everything I've noticed that's distanced me from doing just that. And I see the same thing in a lot of other people, too. That sneaky little thing is simply this. I want you to like me. Uh barf, right? And god damn it, I've had to work pretty hard at getting over it. Instead, I'm gonna try and just reframe it. So without further ado, this episode is called Check Yes or No. Do you know where the phrase check yes or no comes from? If you aren't already aware, or if you're under 35, check yes or no is kind of like an old-timey text, but it's written on a piece of paper, probably folded up real cute, hand delivered through your friends to your crush. And on the note, it would say, Do you like me? Check yes or no with two empty boxes, and then they would send it back to you while you nervously awaited the check mark for the answer. Now I don't remember this as being particularly romantic, it's kind of a kid thing. But I didn't realize as an adult how much I still moved around the world in this way. I was a goddamn walking talkin', do you like me? Check yes or no note. So let's unpack it. If you absolutely cannot relate, if you've never cared at all what anyone has thought of you ever, well then this episode is clearly not for you. But as smart and as cool as I believe that you are, you may have already had an encounter today, or you will later, where you spend at least a little energy trying to control someone's opinion of you. Do they think you're capable, smart, and competent? Do they think you have your shit together? Do they like the things you talk about or what you're into? Do they like you? This is so interesting for me to think about because when I turn 40, all the people who are older than me would say something along the lines of how nice it is to finally not give a fuck what other people think about you. And maybe it wasn't in those exact words, but you get the sentiment, right? And much to my disappointment, that was not the case for me. I still cared, I still struggled, and I still wanted to control the narrative. So why couldn't I just let it go? You know what? I don't know. Maybe it's because in Minnesota, where I grew up, the most important thing that informed us of who we were was that we were nice. We were Minnesota nice. Now I want to be clear, I'm not talking shit about Minnesota here. I love being from Minnesota. And in theory, being Minnesota nice is awesome. But where it goes wrong is all the times that you make sure you're nice, even if it means being not nice to yourself. You have to master the art of reading between the lines, and you have to be polite at all costs. That is not nice. That is image management. But if you followed those rules, you were liked, and that was currency. And you don't have to be from Minnesota to know what I mean by that. Well, it is very much just like me to get the message real late in the game. But when I get it, I get it. That's why I need to mess with things for so long. And now that I'm staring down the barrel of 50, well, I think I'm seeing it all a little bit differently. Sometimes I think about that Sally Field's Oscar speech in the late 80s, or early 80s, maybe. Maybe you know the one. She won a fucking Oscar for best actress, which you can't deny is a pretty big deal. And in her now famous speech, she said something like, You like me, you really like me. Or like, um, right now, you really like me. But no matter what she said exactly, what happened was that she got roasted for it. And she got roasted for it for years. What it made me realize is people try so hard to act aloof, like they don't care what people think. And I think everyone's little secret is that they do to some degree. I think what happened is that she outed that part of people, and that's why it gave them the ick. They thought she came off as too thirsty and way too insecure. But come on, who doesn't want to feel a little validated for all their hard work? Who doesn't want to be really seen by their peers? I can't help but see myself in that speech a little bit. It would feel really great to be chosen by the masses. Well, I'm definitely not famous, obvi, and I'm not a big deal, but there was absolutely a point where I thought it would solve a very specific problem if I was. What would it feel like to make it? And I finally had to be honest with myself. There were no amount of yeses I could get that would make me forget the no's. Because the no's were all I would focus on. Historically, every time I'd put myself or my work out into the world, the second someone didn't like me, my reaction would be to pivot, pivot. What could I do or say to just be more likable? How would it be easier to consume me? And there was always this dissonance because I know not everyone's gonna like me. I'm pretty annoying. And I definitely don't like everybody, but it still felt bad, even though it was impossible. So, anyway, what's interesting about the Sally Field story is that what she said was, you really like me, not you really like my work. And this is where I've needed to get better at separating the two. So, whether it's in the stuff that I make or who I am, now I think I have a little more insight. I think what happened is that I spent way too much time pandering to the no's to try to get them over to the yes team. I was living in the Sarah sales pitch. I couldn't find my own voice because I wasn't sticking to it. So, yeah, it's pretty embarrassing to admit at 49 years old that I do care or that I did care whether or not people like me. And you'd think that's not a very punk rock statement. But one of my heroes, Patty Smith, she feels the same way. Well, sort of. If you don't know who Patty Smith is, she's an icon, the godmother of punk music. And she hasn't been shy about wanting people to like what she makes. She just doesn't let it define who she thinks she is. And she doesn't adjust what she makes because of it. In her own words, she says, you can't expect to be embraced by the people. You just do your work, and the more people you can touch, the more wonderful it is. Her aim is simply to just hope people feel inspired. So when she was asked if she thought success would spoil her as an artist, all she said was, no, fuck you. For her, the goal wasn't to be a big deal or to be picked or to be liked. And spoiler alert, she became a very big deal. So the big lesson I'm learning is authenticity over popularity. Always. Watered down applause is not where it's at. It's okay to want to be liked, but it isn't an audition. You just have to be in the truth of who you are. No mask, no costumes. Then all you have to do is show up for the yeses. Feedback used to make me want to die. But feedback from the no's is no longer important to me. Not like it used to be. The crazy thing is, how I am here on this podcast is how I am in life. There's no way to hide or pretend because I probably know 90% of the people who listen to this. And you guys know that I'm not all that nice and I'm not super polite, and obviously I swear, but I mean it when I say this. I really do want you to face yourself fully. There's no other way to know who you are or what you truly want. So I make this kind of stuff, free stuff, because I think it's important and I hope it's going to land in the ears of somebody who needs it. So, yeah, recognition is my currency. And I'm not embarrassed to say it anymore. I want people to clap. I love to hear how this stuff resonates for you and what it brought up for you and the questions it made you ask yourself. And oh my God, some of you even take notes. I love the conversations it's brought out between the two of us. I don't need as much validation as I used to, but it does help with the energy to keep going. This probably would be a great and also weird place to say, hey, drop that five-star rating or write a review. Oh, but if you do write a review, don't use the word bitch because it won't post. But anyway, I never thought of myself as a teacher. More like someone in the trenches right along with you. I learn by experimenting with life, and that often means looking like a dumbass in front of people. It's a big deal to me to discover that being a big deal solves nothing. Look at Joe Rogan. He's got a bazillion followers, and he's probably also being authentic, just out there loving the smell of his own farts. I don't like his offering, and I'm pretty sure I don't like him. And he could give two shits about what I think, and I'm okay with that. He wouldn't like what I do, and duh, I'm okay with that too. Do I have something in common with Joe Rogan? Ugh. Well, the truth is, it sucks when I put these things out there, and I can think of a million different ways I could have said it better. But this stuff, it's nuanced. There aren't answers for everything. And perfect isn't my goal. I'm not a problem I'm interested in fixing right now. I just want to understand myself more fully. So I'm doing what it takes to double down on knowing in my bones what I'm all about and how I want to contribute to the world around me. Like, what moves are mine on this little sliver of dance floor that I happen to have all to myself? Turns out it's much more important to me to learn to like dancing, not performing. So I can't help but wonder, what would I do if it didn't matter if anybody clapped? What would I still need to say, even if no one liked it? That's a tough one. And I'm honestly not sure if it's a podcast, but it's something I'm trying to figure out. What would I need to say? I don't know. Um, it's something like, I am a smart girl, but sometimes I can be a real dipshit. Sometimes in those moments when it's just me, myself, and I, I can't help but wonder if I'm doing things right. Sometimes I get scared and frustrated and overwhelmed. On some days I do my best, and on other days, I absolutely do not do my best. Some days I don't know what to do with my hands. Some days I wish somebody would just tell me what to do or tell me how it all turns out. I know way more than I used to, and sometimes I feel like I know a lot less. And I don't think I'm the only one. Life is really fucking hard. But awe and wonder and magic and mystery can be a pretty great way to balance the bullshit. Some days, the really good ones, you just can't even believe your luck. Because your little life is no small thing. So yeah, you could just be yourself, or you could be yourself on purpose. And you know what? I think we should both just fucking go for it. Do you like me? Who cares? If you check no to any of that, you're free to go. But if you're a yes, thanks for your patience while I find my voice and for helping me see myself in a new way. I can't wait to see what we do next. Oh!